Planet Descent
Community => Descent Single Player => Topic started by: D2Disciple on May 13, 2015, 05:38:16 PM
-
... I'm going to complete the first Descent.
I've never actually beaten it, even though I came close (level 23, I believe) when I was much younger on Trainee - I played solely on keyboard then. I use a Saitek flight stick, so I've decided I'm going to do it for real this time, on Hotshot difficulty.
And dag yo, am I finding it to be hard. The first five levels weren't a problem, and I started having to do a couple of save-loads on 6 and 7 (though that boss doesn't give me any trouble unless it teleports at point-blank), but now I've completed 8 and it took some serious enemy/power-up memorization as well as several save-loads to beat. I'm finding myself having an especially difficult time with some of the Class 1 Driller and Supermech placements. I'm using the typical peek/homer method of taking out the drillers, but I'm finding that they very, very rarely connect, and they often slam me before I even peek far enough around a corner to safely fire a missile. The Supermechs just seem to fire Homers that follow entirely too closely - I though DXX-Rebirth took care of the infamous FPS-dependent homer glitch, but maybe not?
Does anybody have some tips as to how to more effectively complete later levels on Hotshot? I'm surviving barely now... I'm really kinda worried that if I continue playing as I am (and I'm fairly skilled, even on D3 multi), I'll get roasted over and over again in the 20's.
-
There are some good vids on YouTube that might help. I've never completed it on Hotshot and whatever level I did complete it on was so long ago I forget what.
I'm pretty sure Karx said the fps bug was fixed in D2X-XL (http://descent2.de/index.html) but I have no idea about Rebirth.
-
Rebirth fixed something on that matter, because I remember when I started playing Vanilla Descent that Steam has so kindly provided, I found the homing missiles behaved radically differently, and were much harder to dodge...on any difficulty.
It's been ages since I played D2X-XL. Not that I had anything against it, it really just became a matter of which was easier to install.
-
I downloaded D2X-XL not long ago... I like it, especially for custom-made missions that utilize its many features, but for vanilla Descent, I still prefer Rebirth. I found the Bots in D2X-XL were overly aggressive and just didn't always follow their patterns quite right. I also found the slower (more realistic) Vulcan to be kind of hard to use. Plus I just don't like waiting for the significant load times to see graphical flourishes that IMHO don't really add any significant value to the core campaign (at least for me).
With that said, I found Rebirth crashes occasionally when using the Jukebox for some reason, while D2X-XL appears to be rock solid. Which is strange, because on my previous desktop, Rebirth was rock-solid and XL was crash prone. Guess it just depends on the hardware.
-
Well if you haven't played in a while both have been evolving... D2X-XL has been pretty solid for a few years now.
-
True but when playing D1 on D2xXL the bots use D2 behavior.
-
That might be true. I know that D1 bots in D2 levels behave differently.
I believe that both fixed the FPS issue with homers in D1, but it's possible Rebirth and XL have them set to mimic different frame caps. IIRC, when vanilla Descent refreshes a frame, the homing missile updates its location and adjusts its angle up to a certain angle. Trouble is, if you have a computer rendering hundreds of frames per second, then the homer can change angles hundreds of frames per second. A 30 FPS-locked homer will be much easier to dodge than a 60-FPS homer, and a 1,200 FPS homer will be completely impossible to dodge without putting an object between it and yourself.
Makes me wonder what the refresh standard for Rebirth and XL is. I just know it's pretty darn hard in Rebirth to shake one if it's on your tail.
-
I wanted to see if Descent had multiple save slots. If so, it's best to save under one slot where your shileds and such is good, progress farther, then save under another slot. If the second fails to get you anywhere, you keep running out of stuff, dying, etc, just re-load the first slot.
But I'm guessing Descent only had one save slot. What is the key to save? I tried Alt+A2, but it takes me out of the game, and I see "Run Command" on my Linux system.
-
Descent always had multiple save slots, they are accesible through ALT+F2 while playing.
But it seems you are having issues with that key combination. :(
A shame I couldn't help as I don't currently use Linux, and I don't know if there's some Linux user here that knows how to deal with that problem.
-
Makes me wonder what the refresh standard for Rebirth and XL is. I just know it's pretty darn hard in Rebirth to shake one if it's on your tail.
The correct way to fix it is to not use a fixed turn rate at all, but rather make it proportional to the current frame's period. That way the behaviour is consistent regardless of framerate. Nearly everything else in Descent acts this way (ship movement, laser speed etc.) so it seems the homing missiles were just an oversight.
-
True but when playing D1 on D2xXL the bots use D2 behavior.
Not anymore actually... this got changed a while ago. :D
Sometime I'd like to see an option for them to use the D1 AI in D2 levels as well, just to see if I'd notice the difference playing familiar missions like Vertigo.
-
I'd kinda like to see that, actually...D2 bots with D1 AI...would result in a different sort of game, I figure.
Even though Karx supposedly fixed the D1/D2 AI issue in D2X-XL, the D1 robots still didn't behave quite right, and resulted in D2X-XL's D1 always feeling a little...off. I know it was something that frustrated Karx to no end, because he'd keep getting people noting this, but he was continually at a loss as to what it was, exactly, that he was missing. I always wish I could tell him what it was, but I was at a loss as to what was missing too. I just knew it was something.
-
D2 bots with D1 AI would be insane. All those little drones running around chewing away at shields with the Vulcan cannon at 100% accuracy? Even the first level would make a veteran sweat on any difficulty higher than Rookie. :P
-
Nah I just meant giving the D1 bots their old AI in D2 missions.
I'd like to see if I'd notice the difference, cuz I don't really the way it is now.
-
So I just made it to level 12, Callisto. Level 10 I completed without a single restart, but it's a favorite level of mine, so I knew the locations of most enemies and powerups. Level 11 was pretty hairy, but it's also a favorite. The splash damage from the lava was more problematic than anything - took probably 10-15 restarts, most of them near the yellow-key room.
Just clearing out the main room in level 12 is proving to be a challenge worthy of several restarts.... I can tell this is going to start getting crushingly difficult from here. Worse yet, it's been so long since I've gotten this far that I don't really remember the level layouts, so I'm having to learn as I go. That's probably not adviseable on Hotshot, but whatever - I'ma do this thing. ;D
-
Yeah 12 is a pretty high difficulty jump. Pretty small though, and some good music while you slog through...
-
It also eases off a little for the next couple levels before the difficulty starts going back up again.
Out of curiosity...did you skip the secret level accessible in level 10?
-
I did skip that secret level. Been there, done that... Not a huge fan of that secret level, what with the fusion hulk traps and all near the yellow key.
Plus, I always seem to come away with less ammo than I started with in that secret level. :P
-
Probably so, but I had always liked that secret level simply because it wasn't just a freebie handed over to you but a level you had to work to beat. Thus when you finish it successfully, you feel like you've earned it, and whatever you gleaned out of it in the process.
Plus, it helps to make the next several regular levels that follow seem not quite as tough. :P
-
Oh, it's definitely a good mission (as well as one of the hardest), I just didn't feel like dealing with it at the time since I've played it several different times. Truth be told, for a long time I always took the secret exit in level 10, only because I didn't actually know where the regular exit was. The secret exit is so convenient it's hard to miss it on the way out. :P
-
Okay, so level 21 has the most ridiculous reactor room ever, with two friggin' Matcens that spawn Supermechs and Medium Hulks, three doors that open to reveal Smart missiles, and a door that opens to reveal a cloak when one of the smart missile rooms is entered, and the doors surrounding the reactor only open when that room is entered. It took me about six or seven minutes in that room just to figure out how to knock the reactor out.
Otherwise, I've found the levels had gotten a bit easier up to this point, but now I'm on level 22 where there are so. many. Class 1 Drillers. Save/load/save/load/save/load/save/ohcrapi'lljustdothislater. This is, by the way, further than I've ever made it through this game.
As much as I love Descent, I'm starting to get to the point where I kinda want it to end. I love hardcore games, but this is almost too long for it's own good... I don't recall Descent II becoming such a drag near the end.
That said, I've been impressed with some of the level geometry, especially level 18.
EDIT: Made it to level 25 tonight. Stupid Fusion Hulks (Minibosses?)... Why, oh why did I go with Hotshot difficulty??
-
What's so special about 18's geometry? As I recall it's mainly cubic tunnels and mazes with just a couple of rooms.
-
As much as I love Descent, I'm starting to get to the point where I kinda want it to end. I love hardcore games, but this is almost too long for it's own good... I don't recall Descent II becoming such a drag near the end.
To each their own. For me, it's the complete reverse, as I'm usually bored of D2 by then, whereas I'm perfectly content to keep on chugging through D1 at the same pace.
-
(http://s28.postimg.org/xsz0tjp1p/0525151126.jpg)
HAHAHAHAHA! HAHA! HA! HAHAHA! HA! HA! HAHA! EAT THAT, DESCENT! HAHAHAHA! HAHA! HA! HAHAHAHA! HAHA! HA! I WIN! HAHA! HAHAHAHA! HAHA! HA! Okay I'm done now :P
In all seriousness, I finally beat it, on Hotshot, no less... You just don't get the same sense of accomplishment from most modern games... I can tell this was from an era where beating a game was considered an accomplishment, not an expectation. It got far more intense than I expected... I got nervous rounding every corner, saving almost entirely too frequently, constantly watching my shields and energy and checking out the map. I even got mildly jump-scared by a few stalking robots. I also had a metric crap-ton of fun doing it. Onward to Retrovirus, when my new card ships in. ;)
-
Congratulations! To be sure hotshot is no easy game.
I was just reading somewhere, something I suspected, is that most games these days adjust the skill required to the player. I guess that's ok in a way, as it gives poor players a chance who would otherwise quit, but it does diminish the accomplishment. I prefer knowing the skill level.
-
I've found that most games these days don't really escalate in difficulty... If they have an easy, medium, or hard setting, it's easy or medium or hard from moment one until the very end. I like games that increase the challenge and really force the player to adapt over time. I can now safely say Descent does this... Level 26 was probably one of the most intense challenges I've ever faced in a game before.
-
From what I understand, let's say you are fighting a boss and loosing badly. The boss will become slightly easier maybe on successive tries at beating it, so eventually you can succeed. The difference is subtle, so you think you got better at fighting the boss.
-
I'm not terribly well versed on modern games, but from what one's I've seen, that's only true of some games. I've played some games that don't seem to do that at all. Portal 2, for example. I want to say Sonic Generations is another...but it's been a little while since I've played it in depth, so I could be remembering wrong.
-
Unless you had some objective comparison, or looked at the code, you wouldn't know.
-
Have you played the New Super Mario Bros. games? They're not subtle at all - if you die too many times attempting a level the game takes over and completes it for you, basically leaving you to watch a video walkthrough.
-
Unless you had some objective comparison, or looked at the code, you wouldn't know.
I've played Portal 2 enough times to know it doesn't do this.
But then again, it is a puzzle game. Adaptive difficulties would kind of defeat the point of it.
-
How would you know? Maybe not portal I don't know, there were no specific examples, and it was a causal comment in an article about something else, I don't even remember what.
But it got me thinking. In the D3 levels I made, I always included a little more difficulty on the higher levels. I doubt most people would notice, especially if they weren't looking for it.. Thing like a little less time to do something, a few more bots in a room, a more active matcen. But these are obvious things that you could see, unlike something like greater awareness, better aim, a tighter hit radius or less splash damage, that an actual programer of the game could include.
-
I like the way some of the new Super Mario games did it. If you died over and over again at the same point, it would eventually give you the option to "watch" a guide that essentially played that part for you. But you would get a bronze star to remind you that you're a loser and you should try harder. :P
But it's good for the kids, because they probably won't care, and it's good for the adults, because it allows Nintendo to really crank up the pain in some of the later levels.