Topic: D2-promod

[JinX]

I have been in the process of developing a mod for D2 called D2-promod. It will be exactly as the name implies; a mod for "professional" play. I have picked a benchmark of what I consider balanced (Plasma, homers, and smarts) and am tuning everything up to be balanced around this. This means things like gauss will get a slight debuff in damage (and splash damage), helix will use less energy but use less damage, Phoenix will only bounce once and will do considerably less damage, and lots more. Oh, and flares use .25 energy and do .25 damage. They're now useful as door openers.

The full changelog can be viewed at: http://pastebin.com/vnJhdv8x

My ultimate plan with this is to implement this into dxx-Rebirth as an actual gametype, but that is far on my to-do list for now. Right now I just have a separate folder for this mod. I also need to modify most of the popular levels to include more of the weapons that most people don't play with. If you're interested in helping out with anything from suggestions, testing (going to need lots of game time to get these numbers right,) or making new levels/remaking old ones, I'd love you forever.

I more than likely will not remember to check this forum often, as I go years between visits. I'm often on Rangers mumble and on irc.quakenet.org in channel #descent.

[Matthew]

Is a flare nerf really necessary?

[JinX]

Without a flare nerf there is not a single use for a flare where another weapon like plasma won't perform it faster and with less energy. Flares are 100% useless.

[Kaiaatzl]

Except for humor, and in singleplayer.

Your mod sounds neat, but at this stage of the community is anyone really going to care about professional multiplayer?  I think -- and I'm not alone in thinking it -- that most of us who remain either play mostly singleplayer like me, or play multiplayer for the fun, rather than for competition.
And most of the netplay is in D3, or in closed D2 games where the host only lets in his friends -- probably to have fun...

[TechPro]

Without a flare nerf there is not a single use for a flare where another weapon like plasma won't perform it faster and with less energy. Flares are 100% useless.

Sorry, disagree.  Flares are useful to help find stuff (without using up loads of ammo), illuminating, opening doors from a distance (without using up loads of ammo), getting another player's attention, marking a location (briefly), causing a door to open and stay open extra long, etc. 

It's useful as a aid and tool.  As a weapon, it's either useless or totally humiliating (to the player who dies due to damage from a flare).

[Matthew]

Without a flare nerf there is not a single use for a flare where another weapon like plasma won't perform it faster and with less energy. Flares are 100% useless.

So why nerf them?

[JinX]

Can't tell if serious...

You're asking why make a useless tool useful? I don't understand why I shouldn't, unless you can convince me otherwise.

I'm only nerfing broken weapons like helix, phoenix, omega, shakers, etc.
Keep in mind this is for 1v1 play, not for single player. Flares serve none of those purposes in 1v1 multiplayer.

Oh, and in response to most people not playing competitively anymore; I actually think there are more people in the Descent Rangers that play competitively than those anywhere else that play regularly non-competitively.

[Scyphi]

I use flares all the time regardless of what kind of shape they're in, but I suppose I see your point; even lasers consume less energy than flares do.

I think most players would use flares regardless of whether or not they've been nerfed, though, mostly the same reasons TechPro listed. Flares are especially useful for adding light to a room, unless you have a headlight, and in D2, the headlight's typically not worth it. I'd rather see a nerfed headlight than a nerfed flare, IMO.

Also, "broken" Omega and Shakers? I don't understand, how are they broken?

[JinX]

I'm talking about competitive play here, not single player. Nobody uses shakers or omega because they're both one hit kill weapons. Shakers will remain one hit kill, but I'm considering dropping their children damage and explode ratio so they only kill if they're a direct hit.

[Foil]

Shakers and Omega are always excluded in competitive games anyway, and many levels have modified weapons/ammo to help with balance issues... 

...why the need for a full-blown mod?  Seems like overkill.

[JinX]

Perhaps. It'd just be nice to have a balanced weaponset that can be used in any level you want. Or at least I'd say so.

The purpose of balancing otherwise broken weapons is so that hopefully people will play levels with these weapons more, or maybe turn them on in the menu.

[Kaiaatzl]

Standardization is often a good thing.  If levels that will be built for competitive play all use this mod instead of each author creating their own mod, it would mean less acclimitization time for the players who want this kind of balance.

[Alieo]

I know when I obtain an omega cannon, I use the hell out of that thing. I use them mostly for stubborn micro-robot offspring.

Ignore the above statement. 

[Pumo]

Yeah, but TBH Alieo, your comment about the use of the Omega Cannon doesn't really fits to the main subject of this discussion, as JinX is making a Multiplayer mod, so Single-Player is totally excluded in this case.

So I think your observation won't make a change (nor contributes) on JinX views and purpose as you said you use Omega for stubborn micro-bots, not against other players.

BTW, although I'm an almost SP-Only player, I think the concept of this Mod is a pretty nice thing for MP enthusiasts.

[Kaiaatzl]

On the occasions I do D2 lans (usually with just two other people) we love the omega cannon.  We renamed it the "Backstab" because it's so quick to kill if you can get close enough behind your opponent (like backstabbing with the spy's knife in TF2).
But we're more into playing for the lulz than for seeing who's actually better, so don't take this as a suggestion or anything.